California Condor Making a Comeback

Discussion in 'California Flyway Forum' started by Tuck31, Sep 20, 2017.

  1. ditchbanker

    ditchbanker Elite Refuge Member

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    Im not saying somebody deliberately thought up lead ban as a marketing strategy...just saying it didnt take very ,long for the new products to be developed...and thne Gun Lobby hasnt fought it as vocally as other issues
     
  2. sacbob

    sacbob Elite Refuge Member

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    Well that's the political process .. something is moving in a direction you don't like, but you think it's going to happen and you think you see a way to make it work for you, you just watch.
     
  3. J.Bennett

    J.Bennett Elite Refuge Member

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    Studies that involve force-feeding condors (a critically endangered species) large amounts of lead and isopotic signature that doesn't match that of ammo? Are you sure that's what you want to go with?

    Care to share the study that involved the intentional poisoning of condors? How about the data that shows that the isopotic signature of the lead found in condors does not match that of the lead found in ammunition? Here is some data that shows that the vast majority (70 of the 110 free-flying condors tested) of condors had lead in them that has isotope ratios consistent with lead ammunition while only a handful (5 of the 110 free-flying condors tested) had lead in them that was consistent with lead paint (you know, exactly the opposite of what you are claiming above).

    http://www.pnas.org/content/109/28/11449.full
    Here is link to the tables showing the lead isotope ratios found in condors, various ammunition, and lead paint from the fire watch tower that the condors like to hang around.
    http://www.pnas.org/lookup/suppl/doi:10.1073/pnas.1203141109/-/DCSupplemental/st02.docx

    Care to share the data that you have that suggests that condors are being poisoned by lead paint at a higher rate than ammunition?

    Or are you going to go on another one of your tirades that is noticeably devoid of any opinions/facts/conclusions that can be substantiated by any data and only serves to highlight your lack of knowledge regarding the subject being discussed?
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2017
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  4. Specktacular

    Specktacular Senior Refuge Member

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    Plenty of information here for you to educate yourself, rather than spew the crap and garbage that you've bought into. It's not my job to educate you and hold your hand leading you to the facts and truth. It's called objective reasoning. Be a skeptic and explore the facts for yourself. Then form an unbiased opinion. If more people did that, America would be a better place. But, instead, people would rather rely on dishonest liberal media and now "scientists," mistakenly believing that they're providing the truth.

    http://www.huntfortruth.org/myths/
     
  5. J.Bennett

    J.Bennett Elite Refuge Member

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    Talk about drinking Kool-Aid...

    So I take it that you don't have any data to support your claims? Because there is nothing regarding force-feeding lead to condors or isotope ratios consistent with lead paint being more prevalent in condor blood samples than isotope ratios consistent with ammo anywhere to be found on www.huntfortruth.org....
     
  6. sisqsprig

    sisqsprig Senior Refuge Member

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    Good points. Need to also add, what proportion of bears and coyotes are monitored to even know when they die? I believe they have 100% of the condors radio tagged, or at a minimum marked to ID individual. When one dies, they know it and can immediately collect the carcass to do a necropsy. The only time the do a necropsy on a bear would possibly be if one was taken for nuisance reasons, and I suspect that it almost never happens. Even less so for coyotes. So, bears and coyotes die on a daily basis, we just aren't around to know about it or determine what caused their death.
     
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  7. CA Birdman

    CA Birdman Elite Refuge Member

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    He probably thinks the whole switch to steel for waterfowl was not necessary either. Let's shoot 10lbs of lead into a pond, have dabbling ducks feeding off the bottom and ingesting some portion of that lead and think no big deal. He probably has lead paint in his house as that ban is bogus as well.
     
  8. sisqsprig

    sisqsprig Senior Refuge Member

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    interesting read from a pro hunting organization. I switched to copper before it was mandatory. The ammo I shoot now isn't any more expensive than the lead I had been shooting. And it shoots dam good out of my rifles. For no extra cost I'm happy to have the piece of mind that I'm not inadvertently ingesting any myself, even if it is statistically harmless.
    https://www.ttha.com/article/lead-in-venison/
     
  9. RefugeHunter

    RefugeHunter Elite Refuge Member

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    Bears, coyotes and mammals suffer the same fate as humans when they eat lead...... their turds weigh more.

    Lead is only toxic when inhaled as a dust or ingested as a paste, not when sitting in a stomach.

    Lead was banned from gasoline because it created lead dust along freeways and other heavily traveled areas. That dust got on food or was inhaled by people living nearby causing lead poisoning.

    Lead was banned from paint because kids were known to chew on windowsills or suck on paint chips plus as the paint aged lead dust would leach out, leading to lead poisoning.

    Birds are highly susceptible to lead poisoning because their gizzards grind lead into a paste which is then absorbed into the bird and causes lead poisoning.

    Banning lead is not some cloaked assault on hunting or gun ownership, it is simply an attempt to eliminate a known toxin.

    I've said it before and I will say it again..........

    Hunters should have been the first conservationists in line to ban lead.


    The minute hunters started to see a decline in lead levels in waterfowl and a corresponding increase in waterfowl populations after banning lead shot for ducks they should have beaten the door down on our legislators to ban lead for all hunting.

    Call me whatever you want. The longer hunters futz around and cling to their lead the further and further they drift from the mainstream and from reality.
     
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  10. Real Green

    Real Green Elite Refuge Member

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    upload_2017-9-22_16-43-14.png

    Looks like based on Hunt for Truth that there are good reason to ban lead shot for waterfowl.....
     

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