Endless whistles

Discussion in 'Gun Dog Forum' started by marshmob, Jun 8, 2017.

  1. marshmob

    marshmob Senior Refuge Member

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    A little while back I was at a hunt test and was watching a "pro" trainer. Guy had a trailer full of dogs and heavily influenced the judges in where to let him run his endless line of client dogs. To say that's irritating would be an understatement. On top of that, he would whistle the dogs nonstop on marks and blinds. So holding my tongue, which can be hard at times, I wondered if the judges should give him the pass ribbon or the dog as the dog did half the work as the "pro". So my question, is this common? I've participated in only a few local hunt test but this turned me off. He would literally hit his first whistle immediately after sending the dog. It didn't even have time to get of its line.
     
  2. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    There are GREAT Judges, there are Good judges and a few Lame judges.
    In HRC, most good or great judges will record the whistles on their judges sheets. In HRC Finished you will get to handle on ONE mark. If you handle on a mark in the first series and then in the second series you handle on a mark again, it's time to "bring your dog in", which = Fail / no ribbon.
    Total number of whistles doesn't matter UNLESS the dog ignores the whistle --- if they do, the judge records WR (whistle refusal), and you'd better not have more than 3 WRs.
    On Blind retrieves, you better not have more than 3 WRs and you'd better not have more than 3 Cast Refusals (CR).

    It's not up to the Judges as to where a handler with multiple dogs gets into the line. That is the job of the Marshal. Judges are there to judge dogs and handlers............... It's the Marshal's job to line up the running order.

    .
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2017
  3. The Hilljack

    The Hilljack Elite Refuge Member

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    What was the pass rate for these dogs? Anyone with a big string of dogs running in multiple stakes can create headaches for the marshall.

    The one handle thing is silly. It doesn't say that in AKC HT rules. It's a tailgate rule that was "invented" and has become part of the culture of the tests. No idea on HRC.
    If a handler has to cast a dog to every mark, they should be judged 0 and failed.
    At the end of the day, it's not a competition. Run your dog. Your pass/ fail doesn't have anything to do with anyone else.
     
  4. marshmob

    marshmob Senior Refuge Member

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    Well I'm completely new to the hunt test thing so maybe this is a norm but hopefully not. As far as pass percentage, I have no idea how he did. To me it was shocking because it seemed like the dogs were good, but he rode the whistle non stop. I bet 4-6 times per bird, both on marks and blinds. Maybe he had a reason but seemed to me it had nothing to do with each dogs ability.
     
  5. The Hilljack

    The Hilljack Elite Refuge Member

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    You can go to entryexpress and see results for the test.
     
  6. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    We run HRC 99.5% of the time. If you handle on ONE mark, the judges will score it "Marginal".
    If you get two marginals, in one series you have Failed.
    Or if you have a Marginal in the morning, and one more marginal in the afternoon, you have failed.
    In HRC. as soon as he handled (same dog) on a second bird, it would have been. "Call your dog in and put the leash on".
    Simple as that.

    .
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2017
  7. FieldLabLover

    FieldLabLover Elite Refuge Member

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    The way I learned, every whistle is viewed as a handle, so multiple whistles on a blind could maybe be ok as long as they were not whistle refusals, but on marks should be judged as multiple handling on marks and a zero on marking. Something is missing here.
     
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  8. i_willie12

    i_willie12 Elite Refuge Member

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    I like you hate all the whisltes on the blind.... But like mentioned there isn't a "magic number" Nothing better to me personally as a handler or a judge to watch a dog/handler run a good blind MH/HRCH level in 3-4 whistle but a guy can ride the dog the entire way to the blind if he wants... Now it gives your dog more chances to Cast refuse.. but some pros like to do it to stay in control of the dog..

    Now on marks it shouldn't be happening on every mark, you should get 1 handle on mark
     
  9. crackerd

    crackerd Elite Refuge Member

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    So you were attending your first British trial, then?

    'Cause in this country wouldn't be much of a pro who hacked dogs half to death with the business end of his whistle. 4-6 whistles per mark per dog - on HT marks (and blinds) that usually are in the 100-125 yard range. Sure your math doesn't suffer from audial illusion - being new to hunt tests? Or were the dogs running the test in a different ZIP code than the handler?...

    MG
     
  10. chessieandducks

    chessieandducks Elite Refuge Member

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    Doc, please show us in the rule book where it says you only get "ONE" handle on a mark? I'll save you the time, it's not there. Can you also show us where it says you 3 WR or 3 CR and your out? I'll save you the time on that one too, it's not there.

    marshmob, if your dog is hunting in the AOF, you can handle to every mark. If you have to handle to the AOF, then you are going to be in some trouble.
     

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