Pentecostal "Altar Call".....

Discussion in 'Christian Forum' started by wingmastr23, Sep 23, 2009.

  1. wingmastr23

    wingmastr23 Elite Refuge Member

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    God has been seriously dealing with me as of late.....and is truly revealing some startling questions......It is taking me to places of discomfort and creating more questions in my mind.....



    My first startling "revelation":

    In a Pentecostal altar - it is customary that "seekers" of the Holy Ghost will on many occasions flood the altar - "repent, etc" and leave without the evidence of tongues to "prove" they have received it.

    With that being said - Why is it that there is NO Biblical evidence to support such behavior? People that asked - received. They didn't beg - AND.....there is no scriptural support that documents an individual leaving without the Holy Ghost when they wanted it.......

    Man....most of you guys know me here.....this is tough for me to swallow!

    There are much more "revelations" that I feel God has revealed to me......And it is a BLUR! I am seriously on information overload right now...
     
  2. quackerblaster

    quackerblaster Senior Refuge Member

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    Jon,

    I know we have had disagreements in the past about doctrine and have at times been argumentative, so I will attempt to answer your question without trying to be argumentative.

    First question - Why is there no Biblical evidence to support such behavior?

    1 Corinthians 14 is a whole chapter devoted to tongues. If the whole chapter is read in it's context - it seems to imply that speaking in tongues in front of a lot of people is not very profitable unless it is interpreted.

    Look at the following statements right from the chapter:
    "He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church"
    "for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying."
    "So likewise ye, except ye utter by the tongue words easy to be understood, how shall it be known what is spoken? for ye shall speak into the air"
    "For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful"
    "If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God."
    "Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue"

    Paul even says that if you have a lot of people speaking in tongues and no one there to interpret that people might think that every one in the church is crazy.
    "If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?"

    With that being said - Does someone have to speak in tongues to prove they "repented" or recieved the Holy Ghost?

    We have some instances of belivers speaking in tongues after salvation, but there were always Jews around. The Jews required a sign (1 Cor 1:22)

    Also 1 Corinthians 12:7-11 talks about the manifestation of the Spririt shown in different ways - some were by tongues, but not all.

    "But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
    For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will."

    Finally the Apostle Paul says in the very next chapter that tongues could cease - Charity won't but tongues could.
    "Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away."

    Basically - my belief, from the above scriptures, are that speaking in tongues in the church is only good when someone is there to interpret to everyone what was said. If tongues are spoken - they are best done by yourself and to God.
    Paul says, "I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all: Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.

    There is a scripture about the Holy Spirit making intercession for us by "groanings which cannot be uttered" (Romans 8:26) - So I am not saying that we don't need to speak in "tongues", but certainly not at church to prove we really repented at the alter call.

    Danny
     
  3. Docter Duck

    Docter Duck Elite Refuge Member

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    As evidenced by speaking in tongues...I will say I have seen it both ways yet manifested in another gift if you will.
     
  4. crazyoats

    crazyoats Refuge Member

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    For your consideration:

    I don't see any scriptural support for what is known as an "altar" call, regardless of the reason. The idea that we can set up a piece of wood and call it an altar seems strange to me. The altar in the OT was for animal sacrifice and Christ has fulfilled that, leaving no altar. As the old hymn says: "no blood, no altar now; the sacrifice is o'er"

    As you probably know, I also don't see scriptural support that speaking in tongues is a necessary evidence of anything. Yes, there were tongues in the early parts of Acts for specific reasons. From my own personal experience, what passes for tongues today in some circles, bears no resemblance to what we have in Acts. (I know this will be a point of contention and I don't wish to be contentious.)

    I'll be interested to hear more about your thoughts....
     
  5. onionhead

    onionhead Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    Jon you are a Bible reader/believer and you are finding differences in what you have been taught and what you are "seeing" in scripture - thats a good thing for we should surely be able to give account for what we believe.
    1 Cor 12:11But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will. gifts are/were/will be "distributed" not based on man's will or desire. The gift is just that, a gift - those who are believing have the Holy Spirit within them without manifesting gifts continually - gifts are soley at the "will" of the only One Who can give them and have nothing to do with our "wanting" - which is completely unlike ... if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him Rev3:20 the indwelling and gifts are seperate issues.
    trust the scriptures
     
  6. Lowtide

    Lowtide Elite Refuge Member

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    Jon, I appreciate your intellectual honesty.
     
  7. dc volts

    dc volts Refuge Member

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    [/B] gifts are/were/will be "distributed" not based on man's will or desire. The gift is just that, a gift - those who are believing have the Holy Spirit within them without manifesting gifts continually - gifts are soley at the "will" of the only One Who can give them and have nothing to do with our "wanting" - which is completely unlike ... if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him Rev3:20 the indwelling and gifts are seperate issues.
    trust the scriptures[/QUOTE]


    Great answer brother !
     
  8. Dr.Hidegood

    Dr.Hidegood Elite Refuge Member

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    What about when one is praying alone? Does it profit then?
     
  9. skiebuster

    skiebuster Elite Refuge Member

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    1 Corinthians 14:2
    For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit IN THE SPIRIT he speaketh mysteries.



    Ephesians 6:18
    Praying always with all prayer and supplication IN THE SPIRIT, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;



    Philippians 3:3
    For we are the circumcision, which worship God IN THE SPIRIT, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.


    How are we praying in the spirit ? by speaking in tongues.
     
  10. Dr.Hidegood

    Dr.Hidegood Elite Refuge Member

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    Good understanding brother.:amen:yes Also according to Paul we can clearly see here that we may also " sing in the Spirit" if we want to. 1 Cor. 14:13-15 -"Therefore let him who speaks in a tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my understanding is unfruitful. 15 What is the conclusion then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will also pray with the understanding. I will sing with the spirit, and I will also sing with the understanding.
    As I understand this passage Paul clearly says that he prays & sings "in the Spirit at will whenever HE wants too.I am convinced that this is of great benefit to us as believers. It "edifies" us ...builds us up in our spirit.
    Thanks,Doc
     

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