Steady Duck Dog?

Discussion in 'Gun Dog Forum' started by Hunter Brown, Jul 29, 2017.

  1. Brack36

    Brack36 Senior Refuge Member

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    I don't know what specifically those books utilize in regards to steadiness but if you revisit the sit command or sit and stay if that is how you taught it and ensure steadiness in the midst of all sorts of distractions you will be servicing you and your dog well.

    In training do not let your dog pick up all of the marks.

    If you really want to hunt your dog this year, leash them in the blind.

    There are many ways to train a dog and not one method fits every dog. Do things the way you want to do them. If you are a new trainer there are programs that will more clearly present information and the process to you then others. The clear presentation of material however does not indicate a quality program necessarily. Good luck and if you have any other questions feel free to PM me.
     
  2. fowlwhacker

    fowlwhacker Elite Refuge Member

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    I had good success with an elevated platform this go round. With the stay/steady introduce distractions. Not sure if it was that, my training changes or the dog but do think the elevated platform helped with this. I am pleasantly surprised that my pup will sit and stay and allow me to go inside and freshen up my sweet tea and still be sitting where iI left her.
     
  3. Hunter Brown

    Hunter Brown New Member

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    I have noticed this too. I start with a platform this week. Has made a huge difference on platform and ground
     
  4. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Why do you think a "platform" is effective?

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Hunter Brown

    Hunter Brown New Member

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    I'm not saying it is or isn't I'm just saying I've used it this week and she is a lot more steady. It gives them a specific point to come to instead of having a whole yard she knows to go the the platform. I have ever worked in the chair she will hunt out of in the spot we normally hunt that is flooded cattails
     
  6. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Many well trained dogs "get there" without using one. Most training is based on creating "conditioned responses". When using a "placeboard" a trainer tends
    to focus more on rewarding the dog for using it while learning a command. Eventually, it is not even necessary to have one in the "places" one needs a dog
    to sit (or be in) and become focused. So in a way the "placeboard" provides the motivation for the trainer to provide more specific and meaningful emphasis
    on the ultimate goal to sit when told to do so....anywhere. It is a responsive position from which good things will eventually occur.

    Here is an interesting example. A young dog (the one in the photo) was thoroughly conditioned to return to and sit on a placeboard in remote training setups.
    She easily did/does "stand alone/send backs" 150+ yards in distance. In that situation, the "board" is not initial visible so a white "stickman" indicates the location
    of the line (and placeboard). One day I forgot the "placeboard" and just sent her to the "stickman". Once there she had no idea about where to sit. In fact, she
    ended up behind it. She was confused. To a certain extent the "placeboard" could indeed be called a crutch. After that, she was taught there are many different
    "places" where you will be asked to sit.....that are "places" with no board. It became a more abstract command.

    What this essentially means is that if one were to present a "clear picture" of what is expected, a dog will "see" what is required. Some would suggest that a
    "placeboard" is a crutch for those that are unable to "get across" concepts. As a retired teacher, one discovers very quickly that learning is enhanced by using
    clear "pictures". My dogs have a very clear picture of the many meanings of "place" because they started out with a specific picture which eventually became
    their "place" in a boat, in that dog hide, back there under that shrub "out of sight", in that holding blind (test/training), "your spot in the living room", etc.

    the "initial' placeboard (seven weeks old)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
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  7. Larsen's Labs

    Larsen's Labs Elite Refuge Member

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    Jim - why do you think an elevated platform is helpful? I never used a place board to any extent but built one recently (actually today!!) with the idea that if I think it is helpful, I would donate it to my son who recently got a pup from a breeding out of my male - Gator. I don't know to what level he plans to train the pup (Bo) but after thinking about it, I decided maybe it would help prevent creeping from a sit position. I haven't seriously trained a dog for many years and never did see a need for playing the retriever games but my son is unmarried and may have more time to devote to training to a higher level than my current dogs are. I tried the place board today on my older female and Gator and the jury is obviously still out as far as helping with "creeping" but it seemed to remind them that moving off the board wasn't acceptable until sent for a retrieve.
     
  8. cs

    cs Elite Refuge Member

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    I would add a place board is not just helpful for the dog but also the handler. Much harder to overlook creeping while on a place board. Dog training is a 2 way road to often we only evaluate the dog and ignore our own shortcomings.
     
  9. Slick

    Slick Senior Refuge Member

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    The platform can be helpful but in my opinion not a key element in training a dog to be steady and not break on gunfire all falling objects. The platform is primarily used to teach the command "place" where your dog, after the retrieve to hand, will return to when you command place. Command and dog understanding of place is very helpful when doing hand and whistle command training during baseball/casting drills where dog sits on pitchers mound, the mound being "place."
     
  10. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Much of what is required of a young retriever involves responsiveness. Often times a clear picture of what is expected provides more clarity.
    For example, giving a verbal marker (to identify that's "good") and/or physical "pictures" are useful. Place becomes the position from which
    good things begin. Eventually, they may become more abstract in a sense that there is nothing physical to identify. Conditioned responses
    are "cool".

    For example, this morning's training session was setup to be a quick set of singles. The equipment was two white stick-men (in the field) and
    a white bucket on a stake at the line (which was identified as the "place"). After walking out to the first stick-man, Pounce was sent back to
    the line with the "place" command to begin the session. There was no physical place-board at the line...but in her mind she knew where
    place was. I threw singles, received the retrieves and she was sent back to the line each time on the "place" command. When the last mark was
    picked up we walked back, removed two stick-men, the bucket/stake at the line and loaded those in the dog van. We were done
    in short order and accomplished quite a bit.

    note: these are called "walking stand alone/send back" singles

    Here is the training journal entry:
    Aug 8 late morning....Pounce trained at the Harrison DTA. Ran eight "stand alone/send back" singles in the north section. The cover was
    almost "knee-high" and the 3" black/white, flagged bumper disappeared. After the first two retrieves, Pounce had to mark/run past the
    "stick-men" for the last six marks (fast/accurate on all) even though the trees made the last six more difficult.
    note: The two "stickmen" (up front) simulated the "picture" of running tight past a gun in the "hip pocket" marking concept....which
    she has been working on (look long....ignore the short guns).

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
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