Teaching a dog to stop using memory?

Discussion in 'Gun Dog Forum' started by DWB5, Sep 4, 2017.

  1. DWB5

    DWB5 Senior Refuge Member

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    First off I'm new to this, andthis is the first dog I have ever trained to this extent. And I'm running into a problem. I have tought him to run a straight line to a pile that he knows at about 100 yds. He knows his left right and back on the baseball drill. My problem starts on running a true blind. He wants to start guessing or going to where he knows there is a bumper and not mark on the one I need him to. He tries to do good and to please me. I just cannot figure out how to get him to understand what I'm wanting. He is about to make me pull my hair out. Thanks for the advice.
     
  2. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    my 'stock' question :
    What training program are you following ?

    And, how old is your dog ?
    .
     
  3. DWB5

    DWB5 Senior Refuge Member

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    No.
    I have been watching Freddy king.
    21 months
     
  4. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    How to go about "Teaching a dog to stop using its memory?"

    Running blinds is not about turning off memory. The entire process is called transition. The basic premise
    of a solid transition program is that it should be seamless. It is definitely NOT about turning off memory.

    Some go the route of pattern blinds. Others start with "walk-out blinds" and another simply starts running
    blinds. Every approach requires certain basic skills must be in place first before actually running cold blinds
    and of course the handler/teacher needs to understands how to read what the dog needs in each phase of
    which ever approach is used.

    Evidently, you are using pattern blinds. If the dog his having a problem with the pattern blind approach and
    not "getting it".......then you are not teaching it......seamlessly. And it is not about "turning off memory".
    In fact, a dog with a good memory should be running pattern blinds very quickly.

    Therefore the question begs, how did you set up the first pattern blind?
     
  5. DWB5

    DWB5 Senior Refuge Member

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    Yes he can. I started by placing singles all the way up to the pile till he only needed the pile. And at 100yds he can run a T perfect. I understand that a memory is good and I'm glad he has it. And I know it something I'm doing. That's why I'm asking the question of what to do.
     
  6. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    So first of all, you are using pattern blinds. After teaching one pattern blind it is fairly normal to add two more legs to it. Below are three pattern
    blinds taught and run over a period of three weeks (not every day). When these were lined comfortably then the next step was to do either
    walk-out blinds or run "fan blind setups"......and some use "bird boy blinds". Whatever you do takes some time for the dog to "just go" because
    he needs to know you are sending him for a reason....any reason that is consistent works best.

    note: Some run shorter pattern blinds than these, mostly because distance tends to impact being in a rush to run real blinds. Anything less than
    150 yards looses the overall impact of transition. Going slower and bigger is often faster in the long run (pun intended).

    I've done transition going directly to blinds from single T and it can be effective. With my last pup, I used a different (third) approach The results
    using any of the three depend more on how well the trainer teaches. It is not necessarily the program that makes the dog. Most programs are
    offered up with with the assumption that the "user" will be able to teach. So if things are not going well.....don't be too quick to judge the dog. :h

    three pattern blinds 1st-3rd across 90ยบ arc (no factors - just go)
    186 yard pattern blind (middle) established 1st

    [​IMG]

    164 yard pattern blind (right) established 2nd
    [​IMG]


    300 yard pattern blind (left) established 3rd
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    That might be your problem right there.
    I think it's almost impossible to train a dog using "Youtube" and as you have seen, it will leave holes in your training.
    I don't think Freddie has ever trained and titled a dog at a high level.
    You need to get on a PROVEN training program. There are a few out there.
    Personally, I like the "Smartwork" series of books and DVDs.
    .
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2017
  8. FieldLabLover

    FieldLabLover Elite Refuge Member

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    I agree, he has had problems on blinds and he has a pro run his dog. My guess is there are big holes in his training.
     
  9. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Are you sure about that? :h
     
  10. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    That's why I said, "I don't think.................."
    .
     

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