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The new Idaho Forum parameters ? Vagueness

Discussion in 'Idaho Flyway Forum' started by The Hajj, Feb 13, 2009.

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  1. The Hajj

    The Hajj Senior Refuge Member Sponsor

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    Recently I started a couple of threads concerning boat safety and the posting of photographs. Neither of my posts violated the forum guidelines, used inflammatory language, or could have been construed as a personal attack on somebody. Yet, individuals replied negatively to both subjects, my reply to the boating post was edited and the photography thread was deleted in its entirety.

    I received Private Messages from the moderator in regards to the photography post. These messages tried to explain the rational used for the deletion of the topic. However, the fact remains that the photography post was in no way a violation of the forum guidelines, it was a valid post, yet it was deleted due to negative responses to the subject. I was unaware that this forum was a popularity contest and it was ruled by the consent of the members.

    I did not see any the replies to my photography post because it was deleted before I had a chance to get back to the Idaho Forum that day. If anyone wishes to send their replies to me via email, I would like to read and respond to them. My email address is jeff@surecycle.com, and unlike some people, I am not offended by anything typed in an email.

    The words of an individual are not harmful. They are his or hers opinion, nothing more. The basis of all invention and progress, whether it is societal or industrial requires disagreement, and sometimes hostile disagreement, to eventually come to fruition. No progress can be made through continual agreement. At some point, people who cling to their ideas or ideals, no matter how right they feel, will have to either accept different methods, sometimes great, sometimes small, in order to make advancement.

    The Idaho Forum should be a place for the advancement of ideas, opinions, and ideals. It should not be a place for mutual gratification on a sophomoric level. We can all get that type of satisfaction in other places. People should feel free to express their thoughts. They should not be muzzled by a vague popularity standard which restricts learning and advancement of ideas.

    Moderators, if you don?t like this message, go ahead and delete it, but before you do, try thinking about it for a bit. Take a look at what the Idaho Forum has become, a place where a handful of people control the stage. Is this your vision of forum?

    The Webster?s definition of a forum is:

    1 a: the marketplace or public place of an ancient Roman city forming the center of judicial and public business b: a public meeting place for open discussion c: a medium (as a newspaper or online service) of open discussion or expression of ideas
    2 a judicial body or assembly : court
    3 a: a public meeting or lecture involving audience discussion b: a program (as on radio or television) involving discussion of a problem usually by several authorities

    Does the Idaho Forum meet any of the above criteria? Notice how the words ?agreement? or ?popular? are not listed in the definition.

    Jeff
     
  2. Ducks Doom

    Ducks Doom Elite Refuge Member

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    Well spoken Jeff.

    I read both posts, I owned a small alumaweld sled at the time and took no offense to what you said. To me it was a good post with constructive critism. The Photography thread, if its the one where the original poster was asking for opinions good or bad, was in my opinion exactly what this forum is most useful for. You gave honest and constructive critism to his work. To me (not a photographer) you came across as someone who knew a lot about the subject and gave what he asked for. I can't imagine why it was deleted.

    The problem as I see it is not only a forum problem but a problem with our society in general. We are bieng programmed by society to become a bunch of nonconfrontational sheep. George Orwell's book 1984 refered to this as newspeak, and in my opinion that is exactly what p.c is.



    Great post. I am sure someone who can barely engineer his way out of a wet paper bag will flame it though, thats the way it works here.
     
  3. HaydenHunter

    HaydenHunter Elite Refuge Member

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    Jeff, thanks for your thoughtful post and your continued involvement in this Forum. I hope this thread is not a Swan Song for you on this board.

    In my opinion, the WA Forum has it over this state forum because of the higher mix of thought provoking threads. Talking about last week's hunting successes or about deke placement is fun stuff to chitchat about, but I savor the weightier discussions that we are occasionally treated to on the Forums and I would hate to see discussions of that type disappear from the mix.
     
  4. Duck-Slayer

    Duck-Slayer Elite Refuge Member

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    very nice post. it was a good read...not sure that I saw your other post that got deleted though.
    D-S
     
  5. IdaHowitzer

    IdaHowitzer Elite Refuge Member

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    Jeff

    I didn't see your post regarding photography, but I mostly agreed with your constructive criticism on Bryce's thread "Give your opinion Good or Bad." and I didn't think it was hostile in any way.

    People generally don't respond to constructive criticism as they should. Nobody wants to be told what to do, but it is important to listen to your critics.

    I also agree, debate is important. The purpose of a forum is to have a marketplace of ideas, conflicting or not.
     
  6. Mattcarlson7

    Mattcarlson7 Senior Refuge Member

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    Im sure falls one someone acting like a kid...and whining because they felt attacked because they can relate to something you said...

    Its like the age old mud motor/ jet debate...heck you could even go longtail vs prodrive...if someone said that the longtail was slower than the prodrive i could take offense to that because I have a longtail! HOW DARE YOU SAY MY MOTOR IS SLOW! And thus is how things start. I think your posts were to the point, but far from negative. Keep it up!
     
  7. 7grnhds

    7grnhds Banned

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    I think Jeff's reference to his photography post was the one that said something about using the photography forum. Where people can post pics and receive criticism from knowledgeable members. Not on the ID forum where your'e going to get thumbs up and atta-boys. Do you guys really want this to become the diver forum? Where a select few post pics and everyone tells them how cool they are?

    That is what led to my comment about patronizing. Jeff made the post. It was viewed and quickly deleted. But obviously it hit where it needed to. I'm being very vague here so that it doesn't come across as a personal attack or negativity aimed at anyone. Maybe he just doesn't know what patronizing means.


    Careful how you say this. I tried bringing it up and got flamed by a certain someone. Although your way of saying it looks prettier than mine. I say the society is becoming weak, pansy-*****, little girls. How do you think the EMO movement was started?
     
  8. swampswimmingshrek

    swampswimmingshrek Elite Refuge Member

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    Okay I think I better chime in here cause I'm sure I'm the reason the posts disappeared.

    First the photography thread Jeff is refering to is one that polity told me to take my photos and go to the photography forum that the Idaho Forum was for talking about Idaho Waterfowling.

    I responded and said Sorry that things were a little slow and boring here with nothing to read and the only threads that were running wheren't related to Idaho waterfowling either. 2-3 were for sale and 1 was hunting a turkey. Then said if anyone cared to view any picture that you would have to talk with THE HAJJ.

    With that being said Jeff I'm sorry I felt shooting pictures of Ducks and Geese in Idaho was kinda Waterfowling related. Also the odd ducks and geese in Idaho I thought were related to waterfowling.

    As far as the boat safety I appologize if it was my fault. If my disagreeing with you and your opinion is what ruined it I'm sorry. (Don't really recall.)


    I did appreciate your advise on my thread about my pictures. I did contact who you recommended and he has the class about every 6 weeks so hopefully I can catch him on the next one thanks again.

    Please don't take anything I have typed in a snide or rude way it is not ment in that way but I know how ones typing can be read.

    SSS
     
  9. swampswimmingshrek

    swampswimmingshrek Elite Refuge Member

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    Well here is another thought. If we don't post Diver stuff here, or pictures, or other topics........Uh what is left guys? Why does everyone seem to want to complain about everything? Shoot talk about your divers, I won't have much to say and could probably careless but it might be interesting too. Jeff could talk about his hunting the ocean its not in idaho but I know him and know hes from here. I think it would be cool to know how the trip went and what they shot. You guys are so worried about complaining instead of enjoying it.

    Here is an example. The turkey hunting thread. I don't do it, I don't care. Did I read it? Yes. Do I care if its on a Idaho Waterfowl forum? Nope.

    Dusty I don't care if all you ever posted was diver hunting if that is what you do then post about it.

    If someone wants to post about a decoy they made go for it.

    Shoot Phil and matt had one that was about making boats. They shared it with us because they were proud and their friends are on here. Some people didn't care and that is fine.

    Jeff doesn't like looking at pictures that is fine no big deal, but others did and do. Duck-slayer is even playing with it now. So to me it was worth it.

    Some might not care about Jeffs boat with the Hydralic powered blind that is on it but I would enjoy it. Do I go look for it in the boat area? No. I don't care what they do over there.

    If Jeff posted how he ended up making chokes I would read it and be interested. But if he posted it in the shooting forum I would never see it.

    I think society is just learning to cry and whine until someone listens. To busy telling others what the problem is rather then fixing it.:tu

    Again I'm not attacking anyone or trying to be rude so please don't read it that way.
     
  10. 7grnhds

    7grnhds Banned

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    WOW! Thanks for your permission Bryce. That's great.:bow Der Furher Shrek, Zeig Heil.

    Obviously the sentence right after my diver forum comment was never read or understood. Let me try again. On the diver forum, you see the same people posting pics of birds. Then you have 50 subsequent posts telling the "photog" how cool they are. What's wrong with using the photography forum instead of the diver forum is what I meant. (I have to be careful and not say what I mean on here. Too many of you guys see it as negativity)
     
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