Training help

Discussion in 'Gun Dog Forum' started by Gunner94, Jan 28, 2018.

  1. Larsen's Labs

    Larsen's Labs Elite Refuge Member

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    I think the 10 Minute Retriever was written by John and Amy Dahl. LL
     
  2. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    You are definitely correct.
    My Bad...Thanks for your post.
    .
     
  3. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Just out of curiosity I went to Entry Express and did a search for Jim Dobbs. In early February, 2018
    Jim Dobbs (the pro) is running 15 dogs in Master at the Monteray Bay Hunt test in California.

    I agree that book (his original book) is old, but years ago my Taffey (and I) both began by using that
    book and a great deal of his material. It provided a very good start on the journey. She eventually ended
    up with HRCH, MPR, UH and MH titles.

    My training programs have evolved quite a bit since then. However, one simple concept has not. The trainer
    must be able to teach.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2018
  4. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    Kwick
    Corrected my statement in Post #12
    .
     
  5. EvanG

    EvanG Elite Refuge Member

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    FF should have been done before hunting, not after, which at least partially explains why you have a problem. It's a bigger problem now that it's begun. You can still do it, but don't be in a hurry to hunt or run tests. Train first/hunt later.


    Hold is only the first step, but after formalizing obedience, hold is next. This is just a glimpse.

    EvanG
    http://www.evan-graham.net/
     
  6. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Well, yes you did correct the fact that the author was not Dobbs. :yes

    However, your "correction" is not related to "not being a fan." :no
     
  7. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    My answer was self-evident to me, but I guess not to all.:rolleyes:
    I am not a fan of Dahl, Dobbs does good work and runs good dogs (he is Carr based and not Hillmann based -- as is Dahl) :l
    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2018
    EvanG likes this.
  8. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Well, Doc I had two choices 1) I could ignore your flippy, ignorant comment or 2) not.

    If one were to click on the following link, it is rather simple to observe not being a fan of Dalh's is simply an ill advised, uninformed rant......better left by keeping it to yourself.

    http://www.oakhillkennel.com/traininge.html
    If you view their professional resume:
    Hunt tests
    we handle dogs in all levels of AKC hunting tests. We also train dogs to be handled by their owners, and work with owners who are learning to be better handlers.

    Field trials
    we develop dogs to an advanced level and handle in the Derby, Qualifying, and Open stakes, or train them for their owners to handle. Owners are encouraged to come train with us and develop their skills.

    As for Hillmann, dismissing his historical resume with a :l is......well......just laughable.
     
  9. KwickLabs

    KwickLabs Elite Refuge Member

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    Getting back to the OP. No one has attempted to suggest a reason for the following.

    FF should not be the process to compensate for a lack of responsiveness/engagement with a young retriever.
    The general rule is to have a reliable retrieve FF is not nearly effective if used to make up for weakly formed
    early behaviors......poor teaching. One only needs to view a couple of the early puppy videos posted by
    Lavender Labs to see early "engagement".



    Developing responsiveness early on provides a great deal of value to more advanced training. Establishing
    a team/responsiveness concept makes training more seamless.

    Therefore, even though FF is the normal answer to the OP's question, there needs to be more attention
    to dealing with his lack of engagement issue or every time some new problem crops up pressure will be the
    only "out". It is much more fun when a trainer and dog are a working team based on teaching and not correcting.

    Therefore, what could be done in training to enhance responsiveness?

    Keep in mind that distance erodes engagement. The smaller the distance between the dog and trainer the
    better responsiveness becomes.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2018
  10. Doc E

    Doc E Elite Refuge Member Sponsor

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    2. Good job.
    3. Hillmann has trained more Derby dogs than anyone else in history. but then again, Derby is retrieving doubles. No handling required.
    .
     

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