Here we go again. Texas school shooting

Steelshot Scott

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2012
Messages
3,245
Reaction score
4,107
Location
NC
It is the CYA syndrome that caused this.


Let's try this again. I am not excusing the cops actions. I know that they didn't follow protocol.

What I am saying is that when you have two choices on how to confront a shooter, the possibility that a mistake can be made is a eventually going to be a reality.
 

stevena198301

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2015
Messages
26,143
Reaction score
25,777
Location
HSV, Alabama
It is the CYA syndrome that caused this.


Let's try this again. I am not excusing the cops actions. I know that they didn't follow protocol.

What I am saying is that when you have two choices on how to confront a shooter, the possibility that a mistake can be made is a eventually going to be a reality.
There. Aren’t. Two. Choices. Ever.

Person shooting people inside school=kill the person ASAP. This wasn’t one lone cop. It was handfuls of cops, either awaiting an order from someone in their vicinity or someone there at the school (like the police chief, their squad leader, their sergeant, etc). Whoever the senior guy in that hallway was, should have been advancing on that gunfire. It sucks, but it’s what has to be done. There never was a sit around for 74 minutes option.
 

Steelshot Scott

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2012
Messages
3,245
Reaction score
4,107
Location
NC
There. Are.Two.Choices.Sometimes.

If cops roll up onto a hostage scene, they react one way. If they roll up onto a active shooter, they are supposed to act differently.

Problem is, who makes the call as to whether it is active or not?

If you honestly believe there is no ambiguity in the law, please show me a instance of a hostage situation where they stormed the building within minutes of the call. If every case of a man with a gun and civilians endangered is responded to equally, please show me a case where they rolled up on a man with a hostage and rolled in and killed him in the first 5 minutes. First 10 minutes. First hour.
 

stevena198301

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2015
Messages
26,143
Reaction score
25,777
Location
HSV, Alabama
There. Are.Two.Choices.Sometimes.

If cops roll up onto a hostage scene, they react one way. If they roll up onto a active shooter, they are supposed to act differently.

Problem is, who makes the call as to whether it is active or not?

If you honestly believe there is no ambiguity in the law, please show me a instance of a hostage situation where they stormed the building within minutes of the call. If every case of a man with a gun and civilians endangered is responded to equally, please show me a case where they rolled up on a man with a hostage and rolled in and killed him in the first 5 minutes. First 10 minutes. First hour.
Cops were literally shot when entering. This was never a hostage situation, no matter how many ways you try and spin that it may or may not have been. Only you think that. Ineptitude ruled the day. It’s not defensible. You won’t change any one’s mind that it ever can be. Any cop that thinks this was a hostage situation should be immediately removed from service. It takes a real idiot to stand in a hallway with ~18 other armed men while gunshots ring out and wait.
 

Steelshot Scott

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2012
Messages
3,245
Reaction score
4,107
Location
NC
Cops were literally shot when entering. This was never a hostage situation, no matter how many ways you try and spin that it may or may not have been. Only you think that. Ineptitude ruled the day. It’s not defensible. You won’t change any one’s mind that it ever can be. Any cop that thinks this was a hostage situation should be immediately removed from service. It takes a real idiot to stand in a hallway with ~18 other armed men while gunshots ring out and wait.
Are you not reading what I am saying? S

I KNOW IT WASN'T A HOSTAGE SITUATION. I AM NOT EXCUSING THE ACTIONS OF THE COPS.

COPS HAVE TWO PROCEDURES. ONE FOR HOSTAGES,ONE FOR ACTIVE SHOOTERS. IF THE COPS USE THE WRONG PROCEDURE IN A CASE, IT IS TO TRAGIC RESULTS.

ELIMINATE THE POSSIBILITY THAT THE WRONG COURSE WILL BE TAKEN BY REMOVING THE HOSTAGE PROTOCOLS FROM THE PROCEDURES. ROLL IN AND TAKE OUT THE HOSTILES IN ALL SITUATIONS.


You are focusing on punishing the cops. I am not opposed to that, but it will not fix the problem and the potential for this to happen again exists.

I am focused on fixing the problem.

Punishment and condemnation can come after the problem is fixed.
 

stevena198301

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2015
Messages
26,143
Reaction score
25,777
Location
HSV, Alabama
Are you not reading what I am saying? S

I KNOW IT WASN'T A HOSTAGE SITUATION. I AM NOT EXCUSING THE ACTIONS OF THE COPS.

COPS HAVE TWO PROCEDURES. ONE FOR HOSTAGES,ONE FOR ACTIVE SHOOTERS. IF THE COPS USE THE WRONG PROCEDURE IN A CASE, IT IS TO TRAGIC RESULTS.

ELIMINATE THE POSSIBILITY THAT THE WRONG COURSE WILL BE TAKEN BY REMOVING THE HOSTAGE PROTOCOLS FROM THE PROCEDURES. ROLL IN AND TAKE OUT THE HOSTILES IN ALL SITUATIONS.


You are focusing on punishing the cops. I am not opposed to that, but it will not fix the problem and the potential for this to happen again exists.

I am focused on fixing the problem.

Punishment and condemnation can come after the problem is fixed.
No. You aren’t “fixing” a problem. There isn’t a problem. There were confused and scared cops. We speak and read English quite well. Even comprehend it. You’re “problem” you wanna “fix” isnt a problem because there aren’t two options. If someone thinks there are two options, they shouldn’t be in law enforcement. Only you think there are two options. Like only you thought ol dude was blading. Only. You.
 

Steelshot Scott

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Feb 20, 2012
Messages
3,245
Reaction score
4,107
Location
NC
No. You aren’t “fixing” a problem. There isn’t a problem. There were confused and scared cops. We speak and read English quite well. Even comprehend it. You’re “problem” you wanna “fix” isnt a problem because there aren’t two options. If someone thinks there are two options, they shouldn’t be in law enforcement. Only you think there are two options. Like only you thought ol dude was blading. Only. You.
You are right. The Border Patrol guy that went in and took out the shooter was wrong when he said that he was told to stand down because it was "hostage situation". He went in anyway, thank goodness.

Okay, that is all that is wrong here. Scared cops. We can't allow faulty tactics and poor training to figure in to that. They were all low down yeller dogs that deserve prison time. Following orders issued by their commanding officer is no excuse, we all know that direct orders are more of a suggestion than a order. Those yellow dirty dogs deserve to hang.

And that will prevent this from ever happening again.
 

JJVizinat

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2018
Messages
1,133
Reaction score
1,487
Location
Lafayette, LA
What is a well regulated militia anyway.

It’s when me and my bunch of fellow renegades (neighbors, coworkers, duck hunters) take to the streets and start slaughtering our fellow man who works for the Government, bc they got outta line. Kind of like what my ancestors did before starting America.

Go ahead and red flag me. I don’t care.
 

yellowlab03

Elite Refuge Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2003
Messages
8,641
Reaction score
9,344
Location
WA
You are right. The Border Patrol guy that went in and took out the shooter was wrong when he said that he was told to stand down because it was "hostage situation". He went in anyway, thank goodness.

Okay, that is all that is wrong here. Scared cops. We can't allow faulty tactics and poor training to figure in to that. They were all low down yeller dogs that deserve prison time. Following orders issued by their commanding officer is no excuse, we all know that direct orders are more of a suggestion than a order. Those yellow dirty dogs deserve to hang.

And that will prevent this from ever happening again.

The My Lai massacre, illegal or immoral orders etc and having a duty to disobey them comes to mind. You are literally trying to defend the indefensible.
 

Top