WA state is nuts, hope yours doesn't follow.

Discussion in 'Political Action Forum' started by WidgeonmanGH, Jul 22, 2021.

  1. WidgeonmanGH

    WidgeonmanGH Elite Refuge Member

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    A new law HB 1310 takes effect on July 25 that changes the rules for police across the state. Below is an open letter to the public from one of the police departments in the area. To summarize here are some of the changes.

    One significant change you will see is a reduction of police interaction with non-compliant members of the public, which will have a direct effect on public safety. Under the new law (HB 1310), police need to establish "probable cause" before using any physical means of restraint or force instead of "reasonable suspicion."

    Impact?
    - robbery committed. Someone matching the description is spotted walking away from the crime scene. Police can not stop or detain the person and if they run away, they can not stop them.

    - no vehicle pursuits except for suspected DUI

    - an officer responding to a robbery or shooting scene may see the fleeing suspect vehicle and have "reasonable suspicion" but can't pursue it because "probable cause" is not usually developed in the initial response to an incident. Instead, police may have to first contact victims or witnesses to confirm facts of the crime then potentially try to relocate the suspect.

    - before this legislative session, police officers were legally authorized to restrain people suffering from behavioral health episodes to escort them to a hospital for evaluation and possible treatment. Police could also detain juvenile runaways until the juvenile was released to the care of a guardian. These are both community caretaking functions. However, under the new law, police officers may not restrain a person simply because they are a runaway or solely for purposes of involuntary treatment.
    Instead, the law now directs law enforcement officers to "leave the area" when no crime has been committed, and there is no imminent threat of harm to the person or someone else.

    There are a number of people in our area who are nuts. We are small enough community to know their names. They often get free rides to the mental hospital where they stay long enough to get back on their meds, and are released. Then they go off their meds and start doing crazy violent things. (rinse and repeat). Unless they hurt someone they will no longer be picked up by police.

    The results of these changes are going to be ugly. Property crimes are going to go through the roof and people will not be getting caught for them or even pursued. In addition, crazy people are going to get shot instead of intercepted and put back into the hospital.

    Couple that with the fact that in WA it is no longer a crime to possess hard drugs unless they can prove intent to distribute you are going to increase the depravity of the drug users as they increasingly commit crimes to support their habit. Homelessness is a sport in this state, so it is just going to get uglier and uglier. And crime and defense from crime will become more extreme.

    If you live in a red state be thankful.


    ***************

    Full letter from Alington Police
    Arlington, WA Police Department
    July 19 at 5:41 PM ·
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Transparency and honesty are critical pieces to maintaining public trust.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']It was an unprecedented year in the Washington State Legislature, with Governor Jay Inslee signing several bills related to law enforcement reform that goes into effect on July 25, 2021. These new laws will significantly impact how we will deliver police services. It is our responsibility to make sure our community is aware of these changes.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']One significant change you will see is a reduction of police interaction with non-compliant members of the public, which will have a direct effect on public safety. Under the new law (HB 1310), police need to establish "probable cause" before using any physical means of restraint or force instead of "reasonable suspicion." Reasonable suspicion is a step before probable cause. At the point of reasonable suspicion, it appears that a crime may have been committed. The situation escalates to probable cause when it becomes evident that a crime has most likely been committed. This may change how we will respond, including many calls in which we may no longer respond.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']For example, an officer observes a subject matching the description of a burglar or a shoplifter suspect walking away near the crime scene. At that moment, the officer has "reasonable suspicion" but is no longer authorized under the new law to use the reasonable amount of force necessary to detain the person if the individual decides to run away or otherwise escape capture.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Another impact our community will notice is the virtual elimination of all police vehicle pursuits (except for suspicion of DUI). Moving forward, officers must have "probable cause" to believe that a person in the fleeing vehicle has committed a specified violent crime. This is a standard that is nearly impossible to meet while responding to a 911 emergency call.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']For example, an officer responding to a robbery or shooting scene may see the fleeing suspect vehicle and have "reasonable suspicion" but can't pursue it because "probable cause" is not usually developed in the initial response to an incident. Instead, police may have to first contact victims or witnesses to confirm facts of the crime then potentially try to relocate the suspect. Larger agencies may have the workforce to conduct these steps simultaneously, but most agencies will need to invest significantly more resources to investigate crimes after the fact. This means many suspects may initially getaway.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']For years, Washington's law enforcement has been called upon to fill in our mental health systems' gaps. Much of these new reforms are based on the idea that these responses should be transferred to non-law enforcement service providers. This would be great if these resources were developed, funded, and available in sufficient quantity.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']The Arlington Police Department has invested significant resources into embedding social workers and crisis responders with our officers to ensure we respect the sanctity of life through a community-based care approach. As a result, our officers receive significant de-escalation and crisis response training, recognizing that jail is not the best place for those experiencing behavioral health challenges.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Unfortunately, some of these recent reforms may impact what had historically been local decisions. For example, before this legislative session, police officers were legally authorized to restrain people suffering from behavioral health episodes to escort them to a hospital for evaluation and possible treatment. Police could also detain juvenile runaways until the juvenile was released to the care of a guardian. These are both community caretaking functions. However, under the new law, police officers may not restrain a person simply because they are a runaway or solely for purposes of involuntary treatment.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Instead, the law now directs law enforcement officers to "leave the area" when no crime has been committed, and there is no imminent threat of harm to the person or someone else. But, again, this removes police from many community caretaking functions.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Although police departments have invested the last two decades working hand-in-hand with communities to effectively lower violent crime rates (community policing), these new laws change how police in WA State respond to crime altogether. They may also limit our ability to assist in community caretaking functions such as responding to suspicious circumstances, suspicious people, welfare checks, and helping those in crisis or struggling with mental health issues.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Police Chiefs and Sheriffs across this State have been discussing the impact of these new laws on our communities. They are working closely with legal advisors to make sense of the contradicting elements of these new laws. We hope that the Legislature and or Washington's Attorney General will provide additional clarity and support to our police officers as we continue to see increased violence and rising crime rates across our State.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']Public safety requires the trust and support of our community. As your police department, we continue to support changes in policing that advance public safety and respect victims and others who need police support. We remain committed to working with you to maintain the highest level of public safety we can provide. However, police reform and good policing are not mutually exclusive.
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']In your service,
    =AZUSlYdzHFa7oHN9hp5lg1VhyqJYMern5JKYo-VW46fAA5iHr1LedO0Ov8JHJulQ1rH2LTJDBeC4dNI4xM5dUAf68lp3qLaIjhHG_SMhpoJh5nQc2HEQeSGCenLrFB_kGxK03BH2ZIIPcVuaUap4J8XBTn8w_Kl7ToC2oUnIgl1J0unvuFpS31bkrsXyl40eruL4mECI8bady32Y6wjwT--0&__tn__=%2CO%2CP-y-R']APD
     
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  2. There.is.no.ST

    There.is.no.ST Senior Refuge Member

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    Another LE forum I frequent has a few WA officers, one of whom is a buddy. This **** is hilarious, lol. To quote old Phil - "They gone".
     
  3. WidgeonmanGH

    WidgeonmanGH Elite Refuge Member

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    Location:
    Gig Harbor
    Yeah it is nuts. Sorry about the cut and paste gobblie gook in there. I just pulled the text from the Facebook post from the police department. It didn't show up until after I posted. Now too late to edit it all out. Here it is as just text.

    Arlington, WA Police Department

    July 19 at 5:41 PM ·

    Transparency and honesty are critical pieces to maintaining public trust.

    It was an unprecedented year in the Washington State Legislature, with Governor Jay Inslee signing several bills related to law enforcement reform that goes into effect on July 25, 2021. These new laws will significantly impact how we will deliver police services. It is our responsibility to make sure our community is aware of these changes.

    One significant change you will see is a reduction of police interaction with non-compliant members of the public, which will have a direct effect on public safety. Under the new law (HB 1310), police need to establish "probable cause" before using any physical means of restraint or force instead of "reasonable suspicion." Reasonable suspicion is a step before probable cause. At the point of reasonable suspicion, it appears that a crime may have been committed. The situation escalates to probable cause when it becomes evident that a crime has most likely been committed. This may change how we will respond, including many calls in which we may no longer respond.

    For example, an officer observes a subject matching the description of a burglar or a shoplifter suspect walking away near the crime scene. At that moment, the officer has "reasonable suspicion" but is no longer authorized under the new law to use the reasonable amount of force necessary to detain the person if the individual decides to run away or otherwise escape capture.

    Another impact our community will notice is the virtual elimination of all police vehicle pursuits (except for suspicion of DUI). Moving forward, officers must have "probable cause" to believe that a person in the fleeing vehicle has committed a specified violent crime. This is a standard that is nearly impossible to meet while responding to a 911 emergency call.

    For example, an officer responding to a robbery or shooting scene may see the fleeing suspect vehicle and have "reasonable suspicion" but can't pursue it because "probable cause" is not usually developed in the initial response to an incident. Instead, police may have to first contact victims or witnesses to confirm facts of the crime then potentially try to relocate the suspect. Larger agencies may have the workforce to conduct these steps simultaneously, but most agencies will need to invest significantly more resources to investigate crimes after the fact. This means many suspects may initially getaway.

    For years, Washington's law enforcement has been called upon to fill in our mental health systems' gaps. Much of these new reforms are based on the idea that these responses should be transferred to non-law enforcement service providers. This would be great if these resources were developed, funded, and available in sufficient quantity.

    The Arlington Police Department has invested significant resources into embedding social workers and crisis responders with our officers to ensure we respect the sanctity of life through a community-based care approach. As a result, our officers receive significant de-escalation and crisis response training, recognizing that jail is not the best place for those experiencing behavioral health challenges.

    Unfortunately, some of these recent reforms may impact what had historically been local decisions. For example, before this legislative session, police officers were legally authorized to restrain people suffering from behavioral health episodes to escort them to a hospital for evaluation and possible treatment. Police could also detain juvenile runaways until the juvenile was released to the care of a guardian. These are both community caretaking functions. However, under the new law, police officers may not restrain a person simply because they are a runaway or solely for purposes of involuntary treatment.

    Instead, the law now directs law enforcement officers to "leave the area" when no crime has been committed, and there is no imminent threat of harm to the person or someone else. But, again, this removes police from many community caretaking functions.

    Although police departments have invested the last two decades working hand-in-hand with communities to effectively lower violent crime rates (community policing), these new laws change how police in WA State respond to crime altogether. They may also limit our ability to assist in community caretaking functions such as responding to suspicious circumstances, suspicious people, welfare checks, and helping those in crisis or struggling with mental health issues.

    Police Chiefs and Sheriffs across this State have been discussing the impact of these new laws on our communities. They are working closely with legal advisors to make sense of the contradicting elements of these new laws. We hope that the Legislature and or Washington's Attorney General will provide additional clarity and support to our police officers as we continue to see increased violence and rising crime rates across our State.

    Public safety requires the trust and support of our community. As your police department, we continue to support changes in policing that advance public safety and respect victims and others who need police support. We remain committed to working with you to maintain the highest level of public safety we can provide. However, police reform and good policing are not mutually exclusive.

    In your service,

    APD
     
  4. Bclick

    Bclick Elite Refuge Member

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    Join the greater idaho movement
     
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  5. WidgeonmanGH

    WidgeonmanGH Elite Refuge Member

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    All for it but it has as much chance as bigfoot winning an election.
     
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  6. yellowlab03

    yellowlab03 Elite Refuge Member

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    Yelm PD put something similar out. Democrats are a cancer on this nation, eventually they will need to be cut out or they will take us all out with them.


    YL03
     
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  7. There.is.no.ST

    There.is.no.ST Senior Refuge Member

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    Just read some more from the aforementioned site - one of the guys I know is near - but not in - Seattle. He has almost 30 years in and is now trying to exit. Quickly.
     
  8. oleww

    oleww Elite Refuge Member

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    Is there any budget increase to the corners office? Looks like y’all are gonna need it.
     
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  9. yellowlab03

    yellowlab03 Elite Refuge Member

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    So long as it's only democrats and TDSr's that voted for this crap, I could care less.


    YL03
     
  10. IV Hunt

    IV Hunt Elite Refuge Member

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    They raised the limit to $1000 for a Felony in SF. So now all the ch!t sticks are walking in, taking $950 worth of goods, and walking out uncontested.

    Create a Sanctuary State with no regards to any criminal elements, release most of the prisoners, raise felony limits, eliminate cash bail, and in many cases flatly refuse to prosecute.
    Then they can say crime is down :doh:doh:doh:doh:doh
     
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