Where’s all the EV’s????

[bill cooksey]

There is no place in the US where solar doesn't work. It is less picky than tomatoes. If it works in wet Western Washington, it will work where you are.

Yeah that nuke stuff is great. Plus they promise it will be safe and they wouldn't lie about stuff ...... right? Trust the science.

Minnesota Nuke Plant Admits To 400,000 Gallon Leak Of Radioactive Water | ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

I am just fine with Nuclear as long as it is East of the Rockies and they store the nuclear waste in the state where it was generated. May the odds be ever in your favor.

They’ve been putting solar farms all over the place in the region. Damn things ruin more wildlife habitat than ethanol corn.

Once the leaves are on the trees, no spot on my property gets more than about 90 minutes of sun.

 

[WidgeonmanGH]

They’ve been putting solar farms all over the place in the region. Damn things ruin more wildlife habitat than ethanol corn.

Not even close on a per acre basis of what monoculture industrial farming has done/is doing to wildlife habitat.
Thing is I don't think those big centralized projects are the way to go. I think individual homes is way better. We need to decentralize the grid not just create different mega projects. .02

Once the leaves are on the trees, no spot on my property gets more than about 90 minutes of sun.

Even in the forest there are meadows.
Sometimes there are tradeoffs. Hydroelectric has changed rivers and ecosystems. Now the big kick is put it back the way it was etc. You can't. We can't go back to the time of Lewis and Clark. We have to make some hard choices about human impacts. Some will be negative for some species and things will change.

 

[mo. black brant]

widgeonmanGH,
There is a place in sunny MO that solar makes no sense. I researched four companies about having solar installed on my home. 3 said it would pay off in 20 years, which is longer than the life expectancy of most systems. The fourth said it would never pay off. Everyone used the same figures and two came by to look at the site, and said it was a no brainer to install, plenty of roof area solid southern exposure, no trees. Problem was even using the, at the time 23%, government tax credit, which I don't need to use, the monthly cost was slightly more than our current bill. I addition to the payments being higher we would still have to pay the power company 30 dollars a month just to be hooked up to their grid.
I had read about other's having systems installed and were then very disappointed in the actual performance. I am not against solar totally and know some who are doing fine with it, my BIL is absolutely killing it with his system in AZ. I am totally against any mandates, government hand outs and the massive destruction caused by wind and solar.

 

[rodney747]

widgeonmanGH,
There is a place in sunny MO that solar makes no sense. I researched four companies about having solar installed on my home. 3 said it would pay off in 20 years, which is longer than the life expectancy of most systems. The fourth said it would never pay off. Everyone used the same figures and two came by to look at the site, and said it was a no brainer to install, plenty of roof area solid southern exposure, no trees. Problem was even using the, at the time 23%, government tax credit, which I don't need to use, the monthly cost was slightly more than our current bill. I addition to the payments being higher we would still have to pay the power company 30 dollars a month just to be hooked up to their grid.
I had read about other's having systems installed and were then very disappointed in the actual performance. I am not against solar totally and know some who are doing fine with it, my BIL is absolutely killing it with his system in AZ. I am totally against any mandates, government hand outs and the massive destruction caused by wind and solar.

Sure enjoy a post based on research and facts! Good job!

 

[bill cooksey]

Not even close on a per acre basis of what monoculture industrial farming has done/is doing to wildlife habitat.
Thing is I don't think those big centralized projects are the way to go. I think individual homes is way better. We need to decentralize the grid not just create different mega projects. .02


Even in the forest there are meadows.
Sometimes there are tradeoffs. Hydroelectric has changed rivers and ecosystems. Now the big kick is put it back the way it was etc. You can't. We can't go back to the time of Lewis and Clark. We have to make some hard choices about human impacts. Some will be negative for some species and things will change.

Per acre, solar farms are useless for wildlife. At least corn provides food, thermal cover and bedding cover. As to forests and meadows, I don’t own the forest. There’s a big opening on top of the hill behind my house, but I don’t own the hill.

 

[JP]

Not even close on a per acre basis of what monoculture industrial farming has done/is doing to wildlife habitat.
Thing is I don't think those big centralized projects are the way to go. I think individual homes is way better. We need to decentralize the grid not just create different mega projects. .02


Even in the forest there are meadows.
Sometimes there are tradeoffs. Hydroelectric has changed rivers and ecosystems. Now the big kick is put it back the way it was etc. You can't. We can't go back to the time of Lewis and Clark. We have to make some hard choices about human impacts. Some will be negative for some species and things will change.

The irony is all those Chinese manufactured solar panels get the electricity to build them from their coal-fired power plants, of which they've opening a new coal-fired power plant every ~11 days.

Scientology has nothing on the Green Energy Climate Cult in their selling a "Bill of Goods" to us.

 

[WidgeonmanGH]

I am totally against any mandates, government hand outs and the massive destruction caused by wind and solar.

It sounds like your power company is purposefully dis-incentivizing it. For them it is a loss of market share by adding a fee $30 per month, for what? That is just to cover their loss of revenue? That is the kind of stuff where I say screw you I will do it and pay more just so that I don't pay you. Efficiencies are improving and the tech is improving all the time, so the answer you got then may not be true now (depending on how long ago that was) or in 5 years. I hate being dependent on companies that think they hold all the power to make you buy their product. Just rankles me to no end. Just curious as to how long ago it was that you got your estimate?

I totally agree with you about mandates and handouts. It should be an even playing field so either stop giving handouts (however they categorize it tax credits, deductions etc) or make the handouts/incintives that the governement gives to solar the same as they give to oil. Make it equal and zero is fine by me as long as it is for all the energy players.

But then coming back to reality, (because our government -both teams- does not believe in capitalism) the paltry discounts given to homeowners for solar are nothing compared to the stuff they have or are giving legacy energy providers. Nuclear is not even profitable without the government not to mention they have no idea what to do with the waste, which will be passed on to tax payers.

As to the "massive destruction" instead of just accepting that let's change the design standards. Is there a way to use/design solar that could benefit wildlife? We create false dichotomies. Both/and is a possibility but it will take creativity and we may have to change some ideas about the nature of things. If an ecologist and an engineer got together I have a hard time believing they couldn't come up with a creative compromise that could both produce electricity and benefit wildlife.

The irony is all those Chinese manufactured solar panels get the electricity to build them from their coal-fired power plants, of which they've opening a new coal-fired power plant every ~11 days.

So you are against coal fired power plants? I would like to feel bad about this but the reality is it is our own fault and it will be expensive to onshore our industry again. We either have to accept that our economy has to re-adjust to more expensive products made here with real environmental protections, or stop complaining about the Chinese. Selective outrage about Chinese solar panels but not all the other products that are made there doesn't quite seem fair. If we are going to stop trading with them then lets stop trading with them. But selectively using them to bolster a point but ignoring them on other stuff doesn't seem consistent.

If saying the eco warrior crowd is being hypocritical is your only point then that is a given. But so are the rest of us when we selectively complain about China's production but we do not force our government to change the rules for doing business with China because it will wreck our economy.

 

[grahler]

They’ve been putting solar farms all over the place in the region. Damn things ruin more wildlife habitat than ethanol corn.

Once the leaves are on the trees, no spot on my property gets more than about 90 minutes of sun.

Even here in sunny California the effectiveness of solar is extremely dependent of the individual location and orientation of the panels.
Anyways the weak link in any home solar array is the Chinese inverters. Those have a high failure rate.

If we want a better grid we need nuclear big time.
It’s unaffected by weather. It’s carbon free. Solar and wind power will always ever be only supplementary power.

 

[rodney747]

It sounds like your power company is purposefully dis-incentivizing it. For them it is a loss of market share by adding a fee $30 per month, for what? That is just to cover their loss of revenue? That is the kind of stuff where I say screw you I will do it and pay more just so that I don't pay you. Efficiencies are improving and the tech is improving all the time, so the answer you got then may not be true now (depending on how long ago that was) or in 5 years. I hate being dependent on companies that think they hold all the power to make you buy their product. Just rankles me to no end. Just curious as to how long ago it was that you got your estimate?

I totally agree with you about mandates and handouts. It should be an even playing field so either stop giving handouts (however they categorize it tax credits, deductions etc) or make the handouts/incintives that the governement gives to solar the same as they give to oil. Make it equal and zero is fine by me as long as it is for all the energy players.

But then coming back to reality, (because our government -both teams- does not believe in capitalism) the paltry discounts given to homeowners for solar are nothing compared to the stuff they have or are giving legacy energy providers. Nuclear is not even profitable without the government not to mention they have no idea what to do with the waste, which will be passed on to tax payers.

As to the "massive destruction" instead of just accepting that let's change the design standards. Is there a way to use/design solar that could benefit wildlife? We create false dichotomies. Both/and is a possibility but it will take creativity and we may have to change some ideas about the nature of things. If an ecologist and an engineer got together I have a hard time believing they couldn't come up with a creative compromise that could both produce electricity and benefit wildlife.

So you are against coal fired power plants? I would like to feel bad about this but the reality is it is our own fault and it will be expensive to onshore our industry again. We either have to accept that our economy has to re-adjust to more expensive products made here with real environmental protections, or stop complaining about the Chinese. Selective outrage about Chinese solar panels but not all the other products that are made there doesn't quite seem fair. If we are going to stop trading with them then lets stop trading with them. But selectively using them to bolster a point but ignoring them on other stuff doesn't seem consistent.

If saying the eco warrior crowd is being hypocritical is your only point then that is a given. But so are the rest of us when we selectively complain about China's production but we do not force our government to change the rules for doing business with China because it will wreck our economy.

Trump changed the "rules for doing business with China" and he was voted, cheated, screwed out of office"

 

[JP]

It sounds like your power company is purposefully dis-incentivizing it. For them it is a loss of market share by adding a fee $30 per month, for what? That is just to cover their loss of revenue? That is the kind of stuff where I say screw you I will do it and pay more just so that I don't pay you. Efficiencies are improving and the tech is improving all the time, so the answer you got then may not be true now (depending on how long ago that was) or in 5 years. I hate being dependent on companies that think they hold all the power to make you buy their product. Just rankles me to no end. Just curious as to how long ago it was that you got your estimate?

I totally agree with you about mandates and handouts. It should be an even playing field so either stop giving handouts (however they categorize it tax credits, deductions etc) or make the handouts/incintives that the governement gives to solar the same as they give to oil. Make it equal and zero is fine by me as long as it is for all the energy players.

But then coming back to reality, (because our government -both teams- does not believe in capitalism) the paltry discounts given to homeowners for solar are nothing compared to the stuff they have or are giving legacy energy providers. Nuclear is not even profitable without the government not to mention they have no idea what to do with the waste, which will be passed on to tax payers.

As to the "massive destruction" instead of just accepting that let's change the design standards. Is there a way to use/design solar that could benefit wildlife? We create false dichotomies. Both/and is a possibility but it will take creativity and we may have to change some ideas about the nature of things. If an ecologist and an engineer got together I have a hard time believing they couldn't come up with a creative compromise that could both produce electricity and benefit wildlife.

So you are against coal fired power plants? I would like to feel bad about this but the reality is it is our own fault and it will be expensive to onshore our industry again. We either have to accept that our economy has to re-adjust to more expensive products made here with real environmental protections, or stop complaining about the Chinese. Selective outrage about Chinese solar panels but not all the other products that are made there doesn't quite seem fair. If we are going to stop trading with them then lets stop trading with them. But selectively using them to bolster a point but ignoring them on other stuff doesn't seem consistent.

If saying the eco warrior crowd is being hypocritical is your only point then that is a given. But so are the rest of us when we selectively complain about China's production but we do not force our government to change the rules for doing business with China because it will wreck our economy.

First, my late father was in charge of keeping the TVA's coal-fired power plants (along with their hydro & nuclear ones) producing electricity.

The coal-fired Chinese power plant statement was just that, a statement of fact. Yes, I totally agree we should wean ourselves from dependence upon Chinese manufacturing, of everything.

On a personal note, my cataract surgery and subsequent detached retina is directly tied to the contaminated metformin that the Chinese manufacturer chose to leave toxic levels of NMDA therein ( used in the manufacturing process) instead of washing it out as normally done. So, yessir I'm totally on board with made in USA.

What I take issue with is the political weaponization of climate change and it being used to subordinate constitutional principles. The free market has historically been a much more efficient conduit of innovation than any government.